Grant Lalaian: The PIVODIO Interview

LaLion, aka Grant Lalaian, has released over 250 songs and has been releasing a new track every week for years. He has been placed in 10+ Spotify editorial playlists and boasts over 320,000 monthly listeners. For his full profile, visit his PIVODIO page.

Excited to chat with you today, Grant! We love your story of how you approach music production. Are you still doing everything yourself, writing the songs, mixing them, mastering them. Are you still a one-man production company?

Yeah, pretty much. That just comes from an unrealistic sense of perfectionism. I don’t have any trust in someone to do what I do any better. It sounds a little narcissistic but I’ve experienced people mixing my songs, and I just feel guilty giving them any critiques. It’s just easier for me to do it.

How do you find your audience? How do you find “your people” when you release your music?

I found my people initially through releasing in ways that spoke to me. I got started releasing songs alongside, say, a Simpsons video or an anime video. What that did for me was to start bringing in people that liked my interests and it just started growing from there.

I started getting traction on Facebook and YouTube around 2017, and I don’t know how relevant those sites still are but I still get a decent amount of engagement on Facebook. Currently, I see the most engagement through the Spotify algorithms.

Let’s talk about that. The algorithms can sometimes “own” artists. Have you found ways to work with the algorithms? Maybe even game the system a bit?

My best advice is to always release consistently on Spotify, and all streaming services. Make your own playlists and put your own songs on those playlists but also fill them with other artists. Then target ads to those playlists. When people look at these ads, they might not be big fans of yours yet, but if they like your playlist and they start seeing your songs more and more, then they’ll eventually come to you. It’s a little waterfall kind of strategy.

A lot of young musicians may not even know what running ads means.

Facebook and Instagram ads, TikTok ads, even Twitter ads – though they’re more expensive – if you’re an artist and you’re serious about your career, you have to dedicate as much time in marketing as you do creating music.

I’ve been releasing a song a week for I think four years now? And I’m sitting on a hundred songs that are unreleased. But I’m also spending 50% of the time consistently watching YouTube videos, trying to keep on the cusp of marketing strategies. You could be sitting on the best song the world has ever known, but nobody’s going to hear it if you don’t market it properly.

Do you think it’s more cost effective for artists to run their own marketing and ads instead of giving 10% to a manager or an agent?

Well my experience with labels… I just got out of a pretty awful deal. They gave me an advance that was centered around marketing but they were horrible at marketing. I knew a million times more than they knew, so all that money they had wasn’t really used properly.

Advice to artists: learn everything that you can and do it yourself. Because you’re just putting your life in a label’s hands if you go that route.

Besides being prolific and just putting out music, when it comes to promotion, what else can artists do that can help them stand out today?

There’s a couple different ways you can promote your music. One way is to make a music video and put it out there. If you do make one, chop it up into a ton of little segments and start posting those to social media. Another way is to stand your camera up and film yourself performing the song, putting lyrics under you.

Another way is to take an anime video or some cartoon or movie, and put your music in the background. Those can help you get good views. In the comments, people will be asking what’s the song if they like the clips.

What do you think about TikTok?

I’m trying my best on that platform, but that algorithm will love you one day and hate you the next. It’s the best for artists, but I’m not sure I figured it out quite yet.

Well let us know if you do because neither can we. What advice do you have for artists about to make the leap into making their passion into their profession? It can be quite scary to do that.

My advice would honestly be: don’t quit your day job until you make that amount as a musician. You can keep doing it on the side while you work your job. Do your work, then come home and work on your music until midnight. If you’re truly devoted, then you gotta be able to do both.

I was working at AT&T part time and throughout those years, that was my “music label.” Get a job, use that money to be your “music label,” learn your own things, and apply the budget that you have. I was working four days a week and the remaining three I was only making music. I wasn’t hanging out with people or dating, I was just making music.

When artists are coming up, what do they get wrong the most?

What I see the most wrong with artists is that they’re just not putting out any music at all. They’re not putting out nearly enough. A lot of people ask me “how do I get more streams?” and I’ll look at their Spotify bio and they’ve put out one song this entire year.

I know releasing a song a week doesn’t work for everyone, you need great diversity in your songs, but every two or three weeks you should be putting out a song. Otherwise it’s almost not worth it. If you put out a song a year, people forget about you. You have to be constantly in people’s ear with your music.

Let’s talk about your weekly release strategy. How do you stay so motivated and productive?

It just comes down to music being my oxygen. I wouldn’t be able to think straight if I wasn’t creating music 24/7. I’m looking at my whiteboard right now and I’ve got five or six songs I have written but not recorded yet. If you’ve got the ideas, you’ve got to be putting them out.

I wake up at 7am, go to the gym, and then I’m usually in the studio until 7pm. I know the hours that I’m most creative are between 12 and 1. So I use that to create, and I use the remaining to record and mix. Understand your energy and understand when creativity hits you. Writer’s block isn’t necessarily real; writer’s block is just you not being super confident in the ideas that you have.

Let’s wrap up with some quick hits about songs you love. What’s a song that reminds you of your childhood?

Unfortunately it’s “Cleanin’ Out My Closet” by Eminem. I remember being 4 or 5 years old and it was on the TV in the living room, my parents weren’t there, and he’s just burying his mom. I don’t know, but it’s just up there [taps head] for me.’’

Hey you can’t choose what songs trigger these memories! So when we say what’s the most romantic song, what pops into mind?

Probably something by Charles Aznavour. Not too sure about song titles because they’re all in French, but something by him for sure.

What is a song you can listen to on repeat and never get sick of it?

Probably only my own music. And it would have to be an unreleased song. The songs I’m releasing now, they’re one or two years old so when they come out I’ve already heard it a million times.

What song reminds you of a very important moment in your life?

I’d say my song “Be Jay-Z” because that was the first somewhat viral song I ever had, first with a million streams, first one I performed with people singing the lyrics back to me.

For more of LaLion, check out his Instagram (@lalionofficial) and be sure to connect with him on PIVODIO to receive coaching on your own songs and marketing strategies.

About the Author:

Robert Woo has been in marketing for 15+ years, creating content for tech startups in various industries. He’s also written and performed comedy for decades, with stints at Nickelodeon, NBC, HBO, and more. While he is probably the least musically inclined of the PIVODIO team, he is excited to be part of this note-worthy (pun) company. He also takes a multivitamin every day.